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Fleming or Marlow Yachts?

Discussion in ' General Trawler Discussion ' started by lurch , Dec 14, 2011 .

mapism Senior Member

Marioc13 said: ↑ Note: all boat will have flaws and things will break. But you can not go wrong with either of this two brands. Click to expand...

olderboater Senior Member

To even include Marlow and Fleming in the same breath is a serious mistake and to suggest Marlow has no problems or risks is worse. Of course this question was asked and answered in 2011 in this thread.

rtrafford Senior Member

Things "not going wrong" in a Marlow seems to be more the exception than the rule. I've never heard of this being the case from multiple Fleming owners I know...

hat4349 Senior Member

rtrafford said: ↑ Things "not going wrong" in a Marlow seems to be more the exception than the rule. I've never heard of this being the case from multiple Fleming owners I know... Click to expand...

Adopo Member

Just wow on the Marlowe search function on this forum. We are considering a 53-70 ft boat, and as a new part time resident of downtown St Pete visited the Marlowe yard yesterday when I discovered it was just a 30 min drive. We were very impressed with the salesperson who explained how the boats where built, as well as the overall neat appearance of the yard, with the beautiful boats on the hard and in the water. The salespersons, a long time Marlowe employee said he has never sold more boats, with 5 or so new boats contracted within the last 45 days. The yard was full, beautiful, just looked like a neat boutique kind of place that you would like to come and work in everyday. So...I did what most folks do in their initial search when considering a brand and became a google researcher. It is just unbelievable what is just below the surface you may never know about if you don't look. For instance I remember this auction not too long ago and thought that would be a gorgeous boat to own. Now I wonder if this is the 97 boat in the lawsuit: In short, within the span of a few internet searches I am not sure at this point if I would even consider buying a Marlowe. It even appears just from a cursory look that Marlowe even tried to deny warranty contracts not being completed properly. Did I misread that? We are serious, and almost pulled the trigger on the 2019 Outer Reef, the beautiful 67 Vicem MY that was sold at the Palm Beach Show, and I really like the 68 Choey Lee Serenity but wife says she does not want to go that slow. The other boat we really like for a number of reasons that we cannot seem to find much fault with other that the "pod issue" and interior volume is the Sabre. And of course we love the Fleming and if you have not done so, get the smart TV out on YouTube and watch everyone of Tony Fleming's Venture series. But from what I have read on Marlowe, and having no personal experience but relying on what I can read and research, it is not good. And it appears that lawsuits have been filed against a number of companies that are in the boat building business. Below refers to Marlowe, a link to the final conclusion would be an interesting study. https://casetext.com/case/kakawi-yachting-inc-v-marlow-marine-sales-inc-2 We have scheduled for July the NW Explorations flotilla to Alaska, this may answer some of our questions regarding what we want to purchase as we are somewhat all over the place on this issue. Wife even wants to look at a Azimut today, but everything I have read says don't buy an Azimut. I have read or heard nothing negative about Outer Reef nor Fleming regarding quality. And finally, things are just nuts, I don't understand why we are were we are with housing, boats, cars, airplanes, you name it-except that people are sick of it, and are escaping tyrannical state governments with a shift from the north and west. Of course it is all related to what our elected officials have done regarding Covid. I might was well by buying crypto like my friends. I don't understand that either, but he sure is making on paper a small fortune. Everything just seems sort of weird, like a shoe is about to drop. I think this is the only reason I am hesitant. http://www.nwexplorations.com . Anyway, it is thanks to the members on this forum who share their vast knowledge and experience, that with just a click of the mouse and a few typed words one can find various opinions and facts to help with what I consider to be a major decision.

A shoe will drop. Just don't know when. All three of the initial Marlow 97's were quickly back on the market. Kakawi was the one of the suit, but the other two weren't kept by the initial buyers. Buyers have had similar issues with other Marlow's that they never got repaired and went back on the market, some to be resold by Marlow. On the other hand, Marlow occasionally has gotten it right and owners have had nice times, made loops and done more. Not a lot of boats in the 65-70' range you're looking that have speed. You might want to look at Grand Banks and their sister Palm Beach. They offer great performance. Grand Banks 60' and Palm Beach 70'. You don't really talk about how you intend to use the boat, but a Sunseeker Manhattan might fit your needs. Also, a Ferretti 670 would fit right in with what you're looking at. Choose the larger engine, the MAN 1200's, not the 1000's, with both Sunseeker and Ferretti. Fleming 65 is an excellent boat. I like Outer Reef and Cheoy Lee. Cheoy Lee offers models to go faster and their stepson, CL Series.

olderboater said: ↑ A shoe will drop. Just don't know when. All three of the initial Marlow 97's were quickly back on the market. Kakawi was the one of the suit, but the other two weren't kept by the initial buyers. Buyers have had similar issues with other Marlow's that they never got repaired and went back on the market, some to be resold by Marlow. On the other hand, Marlow occasionally has gotten it right and owners have had nice times, made loops and done more. Not a lot of boats in the 65-70' range you're looking that have speed. You might want to look at Grand Banks and their sister Palm Beach. They offer great performance. Grand Banks 60' and Palm Beach 70'. You don't really talk about how you intend to use the boat, but a Sunseeker Manhattan might fit your needs. Also, a Ferretti 670 would fit right in with what you're looking at. Choose the larger engine, the MAN 1200's, not the 1000's, with both Sunseeker and Ferretti. Fleming 65 is an excellent boat. I like Outer Reef and Cheoy Lee. Cheoy Lee offers models to go faster and their stepson, CL Series. Click to expand...

Adopo said: ↑ I read one lawsuit against Marlow in which there were 28 defects listed. Click to expand...

Jim Miller New Member

SRQcaptain said: ↑ If you like the speed of your Meridian that will be the most noticable difference. The Flemming will run at 10-12 kts. the Marlow will cruise at 20+ knots. Also the interior layout of the Flemming will not support the full beam master, the Master in a flemming is in the V-berth. If you want to talk more send me a message we own a 70 Marlow, that I built new, I can answer any questions you may have. Click to expand...

leeky Senior Member

Jim Miller said: ↑ Have you had any vibration problems Click to expand...

Charlesocean New Member

Old thread I know but I like the lay out and build from what I have seen of the Marlow Yacht. Got on board a 58 at Miami boat show and was very impressed. I have read all the lawsuit information online and frankly would like to hear both sides and also see how things are approached today. I have purchased boats through “dealerships “ and have never received quality warranty work. This appears the norm in this industry as well as luxury motor coaches which I have also had dealings with. It feels to me this boat has a niche in being light weight but still sea worthy. All boats are a compromise in some way or another but if I’m spending this kinda change I’m talking about it first…………

If you buy used, just get good surveys and do a lengthy sea trial. If you buy new, just know it will end up coasting much more than the original quote, that you can't believe everything you're told, and that no two boats are the same so, not that it will save you, definitely get a survey before acceptance. Get a good lawyer to structure a deal to try to protect yourself financially. Try to identify the legal entities you're contracting with and decide if you want to risk that amount of money to an entity with no assets. There are two issues. First is boat quality and it's inconsistent. Second is are you comfortable dealing with these people. Understand they did lose the Kakawi suit. For part one, they've built some nice boats and some poor boats, same models. For part two, it's a personal decision. I choose not to deal with people I don't trust, but I recognize sometimes that may just deprive me of something I'd like. As to design, I think David Marlow is a mad scientist and sometimes a design genius, but doesn't grasp when it's time to go with the design and work on the build rather than modifying things for every boat seeking just a little better.

Capt J Senior Member

Charlesocean said: ↑ Old thread I know but I like the lay out and build from what I have seen of the Marlow Yacht. Got on board a 58 at Miami boat show and was very impressed. I have read all the lawsuit information online and frankly would like to hear both sides and also see how things are approached today. I have purchased boats through “dealerships “ and have never received quality warranty work. This appears the norm in this industry as well as luxury motor coaches which I have also had dealings with. It feels to me this boat has a niche in being light weight but still sea worthy. All boats are a compromise in some way or another but if I’m spending this kinda change I’m talking about it first………… Click to expand...

bayoubud Senior Member

Good advice from OB and Capt J. On our sea trial we never got out of sight of their marina and aborted the sea trial due to several problems and vibration. Get a firm cost for sea trial and haul out! Personally, I would not plunk down 10% until after a "free/thorough sea trial" to check for vibrations and ride. Keep in mind, if you have a vibration problem it is likely few boatyards will be familiar with Marlow's design with underwater exhaust, prop tunnels, strut keel design. Also, I would "only" use gyro stabilizers on their design, no fins that directs the exhaust to the tunnels.

bayoubud said: ↑ Good advice from OB and Capt J. On our sea trial we never got out of sight of their marina and aborted the sea trial due to several problems and vibration. Get a firm cost for sea trial and haul out! Personally, I would not plunk down 10% until after a "free/thorough sea trial" to check for vibrations and ride. Keep in mind, if you have a vibration problem it is likely few boatyards will be familiar with Marlow's design with underwater exhaust, prop tunnels, strut keel design. Also, I would "only" use gyro stabilizers on their design, no fins that directs the exhaust to the tunnels. Click to expand...

Adopo said: ↑ Wow, that is interesting. If you don't mind me asking, what year and length was that particular boat? I rejected a boat a few weeks ago due to the flybridge helm chairs vibrating starting at 1600 that got worse as power was increased. I agree about the sea trial. I asked to do this first but the surveyor who I happen to like, said we should pull first so he could see if there was anything wrong with the running gear etc that could cause a vibration. Still might would have pulled but might not have done the full survey. Lots of good advice on this forum BTW. Click to expand...

Charlesocean said: ↑ What make and model if I may ask. Click to expand...

Has anyone had the mystery vibration fixed and if so is this a shaft alignment issue?

Charlesocean said: ↑ Has anyone had the mystery vibration fixed and if so is this a shaft alignment issue? Click to expand...

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Tony Fleming

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Restaurant-Yacht Chaika

Ratings and reviews, location and contact.

Pleasantly surprised, service is good so is the food. Great selection of Fusion food, a mixture of Italian, Japanese, European, Asian etc. A pleasantly nice dining experience, highly recommended, a must try!

Thank you for your feedback and invite you to have lunch or dinner again aboard the ship in an atmosphere of high standards of yacht hospitality.

everything was perfect - the food, the service, the desserts were the best, nice atmosphere and the location - magical

Best food, best view in Moscow. absolutely faultless from arrival to finish. Best risotto i had for many years absolutely perfectly cooked. The view on Ukrainian hotel and the white house by night is amazing

Had to wait for the food for 1.5 hours and then another 20 minutes for the check. Finally called for the manager and he offered... a 10% discount as a compensation. Simply pathetic! The food is mediocre at best. Not bad per se, but one... would expect something better considering the prices. There are many places to eat in area that are much better. Avoid this one at all costs. More

Hello, Alexander Your comment is extremely important for us, thank you a lot for it. We are terribly sorry for your time that you`ve spent waiting your order and we have already taken actions to improve quality of our service and it would be realy... More

Food is very expensive,very pretentious, doesn't worth that money. Portions are very small. We ordered ravioli and there were 4! Four raviolis! For almost 15 euros. Then we asked to bring us dessert menu but nothing, they didn't even bothered, so we payed and left... without dessert. Very poor service for that price. More

This is a very good restaurant. The food is really good, maybe the best in Moscow. The service is also good. The view from the restaurant is great. The prices are very high.

I often visit this restaurant and must say it’s one of the best in Moscow in terms of quality and service. Staff really try hard to make sure that you are happy and satisfied. Customer service is a huge problem in Moscow but Chaika sets... a great example for others in the industry! Food is delicious and the menu has lots of options for everyone! Atmosphere is great and view is beautiful on the embankment. Special thanks to German & Oleg! More

Thank you for your feedback! Again aboard the yacht restaurant "Chaika" in accordance with the high standards of yacht hospitality.

Highly recommended, great location in the city center of Moscow with a superb atmosphere. Too many menu choices, though all delicious!

Thx a lot for your review! We are looking forward to see you in our restaurants.

Visited this lovely restaurant with a friend of mine. It was relaxingly warm August evening - so the place on the river seemed like a good idea. We came quite early and the restaurant was not full. The hostesses kindly offered several places to sit... and we chose to sit on the sofas. We had some wine, which was good. We struggled a bit when deciding about the food as few options (scallops) were not available. Fish on ice on display did not look very fresh. To be honest it was an unusually hot August and it is probably understandable that some see food options were not available. However, we did manage to order something and sat waiting and looking onto the river. My long-legged friend struggled sitting at the low sofa and the manager noticed that, offering as a very good, proper table beside the open window. It was nice touch and I was very pleased by their polite observations and immediate reaction to solve the problem. Food was quite good and presentation was perfect. Perhaps I can something about the food, but 1 visit is not enough to criticize or make a definitive opinion. Overall, quality place, which of course, does not come cheap. I would recommend this restaurant without hesitation. More

Good afternoon! Thank you for your detailed feedback! We are looking forward to seeing you again, we are sure that you will be delighted with our dishes!

I've been here several times during two business trip in Moscow. The overall quality for both service and food is absolutely top-notch, plus the location is very unique.

Hello! Thank you for your feedback! We are looking forward to visiting again!

Located on a boat at Krasnopresenskaya River Bank this 5 Star Restaurant transforms into a party location due to multiple groups hosting events. Impressive wine selection, Asian and European kitchen...

Thx a lot! We are waiting for you!

It is a nice place to gather specially at the lounge The service and staff very good I like the river view The food is almost like all restaurants in Russia they serve different cuisine. Staring Russian appetizer till Asian dishes Presentation and taste amazing... I consider it overpriced little bit More

Good location. Nice views. Good choice of food and drinks. European and Asian menu. Nice service. Pricey enough.

Had a large group dinner here. Food was above average and service quite good. The real attraction is the view of Moscow from the river on a nice night. Great place for a larger group dinner. More

Hello, John We are really pleased by reading that you and your friends were satisfied by our service, client`s experience is the highest value for us. We will be happy to see you again, come and enjoy some new dishes from our chef and nice... More

The luxurious atmosphere of this place, the view and the location make it quite outstanding. We had dinner here with friends and the dishes were amazing, accompanied by a chilled bottle of Chablis, it really made me feel as if it was a part of... the classic Russian movie. More

RESTAURANT-YACHT CHAIKA, Moscow - Presnensky - Menu, Prices & Restaurant Reviews - Tripadvisor

• Service: 4.5
• Atmosphere: 4.5